[EX-100 - v2.1.4.0] [RS5 Build 17763.1] Lazy ;-) Preset Testing

Since the changes in the Windows 10 RS5 Update chemistry there is a new version out that works again to use cumulative updates. After two builds there it began. The same error when updating. Following here I am trying to find the problem that is currently in the latest build.

With the previous range of builds got stuck in a cumulative update error loop. Making a fresh start.

Trying out a personal build without glitches... hopefully

That's it. No major problems with Winreducer 2.1.4.0. Only Cortana and Advertising Framework. 

Last edited by Whirlinurd on Wed 13 Mar 2019 - 20:45; edited 162 times in total

Current Issues:

Version 0.x

- Cumulative Update Failed (KB4467708) - Error 0x800f0982
Update: In 2.1.1.0 still a component is causing the same error.

- v0.5 - 'Messaging' causing unstable Windows Update.
- v0.6 - 'AD LDS Services' 'Internet Explorer 11' 'Remote Differential Compression API' 'Continuum' 'ELS (Extended Linguistic Services)' 'Text Prediction' 'Windows Repair Disc'

- Game Bar
When removed the icon remains in the start menu.

Notes:

- Integrating SSU (Servicing Stack Update) before major updates makes no difference.


NTLite changelog states as per November 14th release.
- Components: 1809’s new PSFX update format compatibility after removals (error 0x800f0982)

Update:

Winterstorm2050 confirmed that Windows Update is currently not working as it should resulting in various errors after install as seen in the 'Windows Update Broken' post by carlese. It looks like this is not caused by any removal of components so we just have to give winterstorm the time to get this resolved.

Last edited by Whirlinurd on Thu 14 Feb 2019 - 18:50; edited 26 times in total

Hey, is there anywhere where you share your .wccf?

Anyway, if you're interested, here's what I use:

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I'd consider it pretty "extreme", but except for notifications in the action center being broken (right now, I suspect it's more a Winreducer issue since the preset used to work fine in that regard) and not all updates installing correctly (probably because components that get updated are removed) everything that's there works. There's more to get rid of if you want to kill the store and windows defender as well though.

Also, some stuff I learned to keep:

Azure Active Directory (Microsoft login)
Codecs (some games)
Internet Connection Sharing
Internet Information Services
Peer Name Resolution Protocol Services (Sharing)
Proximity (Store)
Remote Access Connection (some tools for downloading)
SecondaryLogon (Battle.Net)
Smart Screen (Security Center)
Simple Network Management Protocol (SNMP) (Sharing)
Support - Wireless Wide Area Network (Bluetooth ?)
Volume Shadow Copy Service
WWAN AutoConfig Service (Bluetooth)
WWAN (Local Profile Assistant) Service (Bluetooth)
Xbox LIVE Games (Xbox One Wireless)

Get Help (broken RS4)
Windows Update Files Cleanup - broken right now

Oh, and for good measure, here's a file where the notifications worked fine, changes are mostly with new components since its from WR 2.0.0.0

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Hi

Thanks.

All those components I kept in my RS4 thread except Xbox live games. I kept the xbox accessoiries service. Did not test if all xbox xbox hardware works. Only have xbox 360 controller myself.

For wccf I shared my own builds also in the RS4 thread. These have most removed as I wanted too. If I find something not working or someone recommends minor adjustments I will update the latest preset. 

As for RS5 I need a working Windows Update. I think Winreducer needs to be updated to fix the cumulative updates. When Windows Update is not functional at the moment I will not continue my testing for RS5.

In the past going from TH1 up to Redstone there were also issues where cumulative updates were broken. I tried everything to get it to work but only after several Winreducer builds they worked again. Why this was I never found out.

Until someone says the cumulative updates work fine or an update of Winreducer is released then I will continue.

Last edited by Whirlinurd on Mon 26 Nov 2018 - 16:50; edited 2 times in total

I have a wireless Xbox One controller and it works absolutely fine, including the accessories app from the store, so I don't think the service is necessary.

Yeah, breaking Windows Update happens pretty quickly I'm afraid. Would be very interesting to find out which components exactly are responsible. I haven't had the patience to find out though.

Have found your preset and will have a look.

I'm getting the error 0x80246010 when trying to install KB4464330 btw. maybe that information could help you.

Hi.

I am back for the next round. New builds and a new winreducer version. Currently version 3 is still causing the dreaded 0x800f0982 error. Reverted  almost everything back to version 2 but still the error remains.

After a dozen builds I am almost there.

Between brackets is added back over several builds. The X is currently added to the latest build.

Last edited by Whirlinurd on Sat 26 Jan 2019 - 3:44; edited 1 time in total

Hello

Have you try the procedure I described in this post ?
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.][/i]

Have a great day !

So, just to be clear, version 2 doesn't cause the error? Also, I see that you're trying to remove Cortana and OOBE (Cortana) for v3. From my understanding, removing Cortana breaks the Windows Search functionality and I'm currently testing a problem where OOBE errors out and can't be completed which I suspect is caused by OOBE (Cortana) removal.

Hi. Currently I am just adding components back to find the cumulative error. The components between brackets are added back to the latest version. Still the error remains.

It was possible to remove Cortana in the RS4 extreme build I made earlier in the RS4 thread. I will see what it does for RS5.

A few versions back we tracked down the OOBE errors for RS4. These were OOBeIDPS and OOBERegion. One was a bug with the removal with United Kingdom and the OOBeIDPS I tracked down to the removal of Azure Active Directory.

I did remove OOBE (Cortana) for version 3 as it was in the removal list and it did not give any setup errors for me.

What kind of OOBE error is it this time?

I posted some details in this thread: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Hi.

Thanks.

I will add it to my project list. As I progress further into newer reduced versions it will probably come up at one point. As it is only when (OOBE) cortana is removed and it resolves when added it should be a conflict with another component.

My policy is to use a non integrated install since I want no conflicts in every aspect of the reduced windows.

Are you also using a clean setup or do you integrate updates as well?

Hello Whirlinurd

Could you please have a look at this post, about the "OOBE (Cortana)" bug :
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Hello everybody.

Finally some progress for version 0.5. In the current configuration the removal of 'messaging' causes the cumulative update to fail to initialize the update procedure. After a second restart of Windows updates it installs fine.

When 'messaging' is not removed the cumulative update installs without problems.

Maybe this also causes the 'preparing updates' lockup.

Hi Whirlinurd. Just want to thank you for everything you're doing here. I killed my brain trying to get a bug-free W10 that was significantly reduced. Kept running into random start-up problems, failed installations, OOBE errors and task view crashes. Fixing one problem just created another, or new (more serious) bugs were discovered after extensive use. For 2 or 3 months now I've just had to accept a normal W10. Good luck with this! You've shown a lot of perseverance.

Thanks soda.

It surely takes several builds and installations to track down one or more components. Still focusing on the update problem. In version 0.5 it finally worked and in version 0.6 it is giving restarts and update lockups again. When I did this for RS4 it cleared up some bugs. Hopefully Winterstorm can use my findings again for RS5.

Hi everybody.

Finally v0.6 testing is finished. Found the following components to be unstable for Windows Update resulting in a 'Preparing updates' lockup or a non updated Windows restart.

- AD LDS Services
- Internet Explorer 11
- Remote Differential Compression API
- Continuum
- ELS (Extended Linguistic Services)-
- Text Prediction
- Windows Repair Disc'


ps. Second install of same build rebooted again without updating. Something very unstable in reducing Windows.

Last edited by Whirlinurd on Thu 14 Feb 2019 - 18:49; edited 1 time in total

Hello Whirlinurd

Thank you very much for all your tests .... they are very important to narrow down many bugs !

About the components you found which break windows updates ... have you updated EX-100 to v2.1.4.0 ? Have you activated "Presets - Protect Windows Update" ?

I wish you to have a very great day !

Hi.

Yes I am using Protect Windows Update. Just updated to Winreducer 2.1.4.0 after v0.6. I must say all these tests are unreliable since the first install worked and the second did not. I can not say for sure that every component that I removed really gives the 'second reboot update install bug'.

If I really want to test in that aspect I have to install every build twice. I will do some basic builds again with 2.1.4.0 and will see where I will end up. Going to spend some time on this next week.

Hi.

Everything is great again with Winreducer. Had no real problems building my daily driver preset. No need for extreme testing anymore.

Only one small issue. Somehow 'remove clock' got enabled for removal. I do not think I did this. When I disable the check it still saves as true in the preset. When manually changing the preset to false it also loads the preset as it is not going to be removed. The final install iso that is made still removes the clock from the taskbar.

When I want to customize the taskbar icons the clock is set to 'on' but the toggle is grayed out.

Update: My bad. Did not see the taskbar clock enabled in accessories. Somehow I made a mistake there.

Maybe this is a little glitch in Winreducer. Never had this happen before.

Hey, do you share your latest preset anywhere? I can't find it and would be interested to take a look.

Hi anon768.

I have not checked here in a while. Just did a quick browse of the forum and spotted your post. Did not expect to find you here and be interested in my latest preset. I must say this is not the latest preset I made when testing the latest version. The only preset I kept was freshly made after my findings with the WinReducer 2.1.4.0 experience. I have no troubles since I have installed it.

It has...

- Xbox compatibility for games that still need a working Xbox Live account. Not sure but kept it.
- Microsoft Store and things. Kept it but not sure if its 100% working. Don't use it myself. I think its ok.
- Microsoft Edge. Kept it for compatibility. Think there were some issues with Windows Update.
- Disabled automated paging file.

Set minimum size is 200mb static. Recommended 800mb static. Some people say to disable the paging file when there is enough memory in the system. I think Windows still uses the swap for Error reporting and other things. For compatibility reasons I still set a small amount.

Do not set 1.5 times the internal memory some internet searches recommend. That is old school rubbish. 

Also about memory cleaners apps. Devices fill there internal memory to keep it responsive. The more memory a system uses the better. The internal memory management in operating systems today will free memory when it is needed. We do not live in the 640kb memory days anymore when memory was precious.

Oops going on a tangent here...

He he.

Here you go...

WinReducer 2.1.4.0 Personal Preset 

Probably to my liking 99 percent is removed. Maybe there are still some components that can be removed but I kept them still to be on the safe side of things.

Whirlinurd wrote:

Set minimum size is 200mb static. Recommended 800mb static. Some people say to disable the paging file when there is enough memory in the system. I think Windows still uses the swap for Error reporting and other things. For compatibility reasons I still set a small amount.

im using since years now 16mb with my 16gb and 32gb ram notebooks/workstations and had never problems with runing out of memory

im not sure if its still present but when disabling it in win7 and early win10 (TH builds) i couldnt use windows update and windows features after reducing windows, thats why i chose 16mb pagefile and like i said its working since years

Hi.

Thanks. I did this research how Windows responds surely a long time ago when I really wanted to know how the pagefile reacts to the operating system. There were probably more systems going around that had a lot less internal memory than we have now as standard. At that time I read that the recommended pagefile size was 200mb for Windows 7, 400mb for Windows 8 and 800mb for Windows 10 when having 4gb of internal memory but this was as you said also in the TH builds era.

Not knowing how many systems still use 4gb I just always recommend a minimum pagefile of 200mb as default to be safe. Off course when having 16gb or more memory you can do fine with less.

Whirlinurd wrote:

Hi anon768.

I have not checked here in a while. Just did a quick browse of the forum and spotted your post. Did not expect to find you here and be interested in my latest preset. I must say this is not the latest preset I made when testing the latest version. The only preset I kept was freshly made after my findings with the WinReducer 2.1.4.0 experience. I have no troubles since I have installed it.

It has...

- Xbox compatibility for games that still need a working Xbox Live account. Not sure but kept it.
- Microsoft Store and things. Kept it but not sure if its 100% working. Don't use it myself. I think its ok.
- Microsoft Edge. Kept it for compatibility. Think there were some issues with Windows Update.
- Disabled automated paging file.

Set minimum size is 200mb static. Recommended 800mb static. Some people say to disable the paging file when there is enough memory in the system. I think Windows still uses the swap for Error reporting and other things. For compatibility reasons I still set a small amount.

Do not set 1.5 times the internal memory some internet searches recommend. That is old school rubbish. 

Also about memory cleaners apps. Devices fill there internal memory to keep it responsive. The more memory a system uses the better. The internal memory management in operating systems today will free memory when it is needed. We do not live in the 640kb memory days anymore when memory was precious.

Oops going on a tangent here...

He he.

Here you go...

WinReducer 2.1.4.0 Personal Preset 

Probably to my liking 99 percent is removed. Maybe there are still some components that can be removed but I kept them still to be on the safe side of things.

Thanks!

There sadly aren't too many people interested in this stuff, and even fewer that are as diligent in their testing as you, so your findings are always appreciated!

I always set my page file to 2048mb just to be on the safe side. In the end, saving 2GB of storage really isn't all that important, and it can potentially save a lot of headache dealing with page file related errors. I know for a fact that at least some games don't play nice with a disabled or too small page file, namely S.T.A.L.K.E.R. 2GB is probably more than necessary, but it's a value that has worked well for me over the years.

I've noticed you also keep windows search. Personally I'm.. really not a fan, and just use Everything for general searching purposes and OpenShell for a new start menu, that serves me pretty well as an indefinitely better replacement to the integrated search.

Also, you are still keeping all the themes, wallpapers, etc. If you don't use them, that's a pretty trouble free thing to remove.

If you happen to be interested, here's my latest preset.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

So far, everything is working nicely, including updates and the Windows Store. With one caveat, I can't log into the microsoft account from either the store or the Xbox app. That's sadly a recurring issue I still have to investigate. Of course, if you have any pointers, I'd be happy to hear them.

Thanks for sharing your preset and your insights!

Hi anon768.

Thanks for trying my own preset. Had no idea that logging in to Microsoft account is not working at the moment. As you said this is a recurring issue I think you mean that this is currently not working with WinReducer in general or do you believe it is component related?

As for Windows Search I thought removing all related components resulted in Windows Update problems.

And third for the themes and wallpapers. Since my latest preset is as I said not so extreme anymore I kept all related Windows components that aren't as relevant for removal.

I will try a second build based on my 'lazy' preset comparing it to your latest. Lets see I can tweak it here and there for a not so lazy version 2.

BRB after a few test builds... please correct me if I go to far :-)

Preset v0.2
- Protect Windows Search - Disable

Features
- Net Framework 3.5 - Enable. Seems logical when component kept. (?)

Remover - Accessoiries
- Natural Languages
- Windows Search (Filters) - All

Remover - Control Panels
- Control Panel - Indexing Options + (Files)

Update: Removing as in v0.2 configuration results in a Windows Update restart loop as I expected.


I see anon768 that your preset has Windows Updates integrated. This way more components are removable but this does not result in a completely stable Windows Update experience.

My own goal of this thread was called 'extreme preset testing' to improve the reliability of the WinReducer program but it is still not my intention to remove components that affect the basic functionality of Windows 10.

Even in my own 'lazy' preset that I use I still have a few minor bugs present that I can not track down at the moment. Until Winterstorm has free time and with conjunction of the VIP testers a new version rolls out I probably will try to improve the current preset I have.

Until then if some one wants to use my preset you can download it above. I will gladly hear any hints or tips if you have any.

Whirlinurd wrote:

Hi anon768.

Thanks for trying my own preset. Had no idea that logging in to Microsoft account is not working at the moment. As you said this is a recurring issue I think you mean that this is currently not working with WinReducer in general or do you believe it is component related?

As for Windows Search I thought removing all related components resulted in Windows Update problems.

And third for the themes and wallpapers. Since my latest preset is as I said not so extreme anymore I kept all related Windows components that aren't as relevant for removal.

I will try a second build based on my 'lazy' preset comparing it to your latest. Lets see I can tweak it here and there for a not so lazy version 2.

BRB after a few test builds... please correct me if I go to far :-)

Preset v0.2
- Protect Windows Search - Disable

Features
- Net Framework 3.5 - Enable. Seems logical when component kept. (?)

Remover - Accessoiries
- Natural Languages
- Windows Search (Filters) - All

Remover - Control Panels
- Control Panel - Indexing Options + (Files)

Update: Removing as in v0.2 configuration results in a Windows Update restart loop as I expected.


I see anon768 that your preset has Windows Updates integrated. This way more components are removable but this does not result in a completely stable Windows Update experience.

My own goal of this thread was called 'extreme preset testing' to improve the reliability of the WinReducer program but it is still not my intention to remove components that affect the basic functionality of Windows 10.

Even in my own 'lazy' preset that I use I still have a few minor bugs present that I can not track down at the moment. Until Winterstorm has free time and with conjunction of the VIP testers a new version rolls out I probably will try to improve the current preset I have.

Until then if some one wants to use my preset you can download it above. I will gladly hear any hints or tips if you have any.

I see.

Since the

- UNDER INVESTIGATION = "Optimizations - EXPERT - Windows Updates Files Cleanup" : Error with WIndows Updates slipstreaming (before installation) and Cumulative Updates integration (after installation)

from WInReducer 2.1.1.0, updates have worked perfectly for me so far. Granted, my current build as only been running for two weeks or so, but previously I would have to get lucky for any updates to install properly at all. I wondered why you didn't just integrate them.

IIRC, .NET Framework 3.5 is an optional component since Windows 10, enabling it seems sensible considering a ton of applications rely on it.

As far as the Microsoft Account thing goes, I'm personally at a bit of a loss. It definitely breaks across different WinReducer versions with the same preset, iirc it also broke when I switches from RS4 to RS5 as the base, it doesn't break when not removing anything and it doesn't break with a very light preset, but it does break when keeping everything (that as far as I can tell) related to any sort of synching, account stuff or microsoft apps is kept. I thought I nailed it down once, but then it stopped working again with a new winreducer version. Besides that, I actually use different presets for my desktop and laptop, and sometimes it works on my laptop and not on my desktop although the laptop preset is more agressive in terms of removing all the Microsoft Apps and sync related stuff.

Testing has continued on my end. I've restarted with the latest version of Windows (1903/RS6), which seems to be incredibly unstable to play around with. I don't know if the fault is WinReducer not updated enough, or just Windows itself. Loading any of my old "safe" presets causes the system to break with:
- OOBE errors
- Failure to install or severe 'hangs'
- Crashes on opening Apps/Features
- Random "Unknown Hard Error" sihost.exe message
- "Class not registered" explorer.exe message
- "Array bounds exceeded" SystemSettings.exe message
- "Windows could not update the computer's boot configuration" error on install.
- Unable to connect to a network or login again after restart

- WinReducer 'Clean up unneeded versions' is also broken.
- Start Menu and Search nearly always breaks - WITHOUT touching Search or Cortana!
- WinReducer (sometimes) closes randomly on the final cleaning stages, silently creating an ISO.
- WinReducer creates ISOs bigger than the original Windows ISO. 
- Apparently.. nothing is removed because after completion, the "ExtractedByWinreducer" folder is 4.56gb but the installation is still made with bugs.


I decided to work backwards, undoing things I had previously set to remove, but encountered more problems each time. Weird! No chance of narrowing things down.. So now I have started again with a clean preset. It's been a long time since I last tested a customised Windows 10. I've begun removing basic items that have never caused problems before, and still anomalies continue to appear which are completely unrelated to what I set to remove. It would be amazing to create the perfect preset but I can't see this will be possible for a long time.

Hi Watson.

Great to see you here to let me know how it stands. Also thought about it to start on RS6 since I saw that Winreducer has RS6 support now. Only I am still hesitating to do so because it is only still support. Most of the time I wait a few versions of Winreducer to iron out the most aggravating basic issues that only Winterstorm can resolve.

I will try to get a RS6 image somewhere soon to try out myself and to see what my initial finding are. If it is to my liking I probably will enter a new RS6 preset testing phase again.

Hello guys

I confirm that RS6 is not stable enough with v2.1.7.0 ... but .... I will release very soon a new build v2.1.8.0 (probably Thursday or Friday for "ALL" users) with fixes for :
- Cumulative Update integration (after Windows installation) with removed "Drivers"
- installation boot loop during OOBE

There are also other bugs reports to solve, without installation trouble, so I will check them for the end of the week

Have a great day my friends !

Watson wrote:

- WinReducer creates ISOs bigger than the original Windows ISO.
- Apparently.. nothing is removed because after completion, the "ExtractedByWinreducer" folder is 4.56gb but the installation is still made with bugs.

Are you using, "Presets - Protect Windows Update" ? If yes, as MS has changed the Cumulative Updates (="CU") system, which requires to keep much more files to correctly install these "CU" .. don't worry I'm still searching how to bypass this, but as you know, this is not an easy task due to the highly sensitive subject !